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UserID: jrsolsjeff Type: Facebook Joined: Apr 15 2013
Thread Started: Apr 16 2013 Last Post: May 09 2013 Last Post By: jrsolsjeff
Origin: General Topics Total Posts: 11

Scared of Ablation

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Posted Apr 16 2013#1 of 11
jrsolsjeffUser Since: Apr 2013Posts: 15Bare with me..I’m new and have a lot to say LOL
In addition to PVC’s, I possibly have PSVT. My Cardiologist has referred me to conultation with an EP for ablation for the PSVT. He is not concerned at all about my PVC’s. However he has not given me a definitive daignosis of PSVT. He ordered a 30 day holter which my insurance denied. Based on my symptoms when I describe these ”episodes” and the fact I have had probably 40 normal ECG’s (between two cardiologist, multiple ER visits and two GP’s) as well as 2 normal 24 hour holters, one 7 day holter and two echo’s all normal, he feels PSVT is the cause of what I call “episodes”.

These episodes start with 4-5 very aggressive thumps in my chest (PVC’s, but stronger than the ones I get daily) from there my heart rate escilates rapidly from a normal 70-80 bpm to almost 200 bpm within a minute or less. Just as rapidly as it begins, it stops after 1-5 minutes of steady tachycardia. I usually end up taking 5-10mg of inderal. This is accompanied with shortness of breath and lightheadedness. It is not a panic attack because sometimes I will feel PVC’s and panic with anticipation that this “episode” will occur and most times, even with the panic…it doesn’t. Then when I last expect it, I’ll get these stronger PVC’s then suddenly Im in a whirlwind of tachycardia. When I have panic attacks they last from at least 10 mins to what feels like eternity and the anxiety before and after is consuming. These episodes are more frightening than panic attacks because they seem more real but recovery is much better for some reason. It concerns me because the fear of the stronger PVC’s triggering a tachycardia puts me in fear of developing ventricle fibrilation. I don’t know why, it just does. I get these episodes about once a month with no ryhme or reason to them. I thought maybe they were associated with my cycle and caused by hormones but that’s not always the case so my assumption now is they are just random.

A few facts about me, 32 yrs Female, history of anxiety and panic disorder. Digestive issue’s (slow bowels, heart burn) even on a very healthy diet of lean fish and raw fruits/veggies. I have a gluten intolerance, history of presyncope and chronic low blood pressure.

My questions are as follows
Has anybody here had ablation for a ventricle tachycardia and was it a cause for PVC’s or make PVC’s worse? I am afraid that ablating the tachycardia will cause PVC’s to worsen. I don’t want to correct one issue and make another worse.
Does anybody here have PSVT and does my situation sound like what you go through, are strong PVC’s a common precursor?
Does the benefit of ablation outweigh the risk? A question for a Dr I know but in your experience (for anyone who has experience) was it a benefit?
Has anyone had their PSVT get worse or more frequent if not treated or anyone ever experience it goes away or lessons over time?


I am terrified to have a procedure done since I don’t trust doctors and I always cure naturally. But the PSVT is so frightening at times I think Ill do anything to get rid of it. It is scarier than PVC’s, PVCs are daily so more of a bother and cause anxiety but the PSVT is a nightmare. I honestly don’t know which is worse. One is everyday but the other is more vicious.
Posted Apr 19 2013#2 of 11
PVCManUser Since: Oct 2009Posts: 228Hi jrsolsjeff,

I'm sad to see no-one has replied to this yet.

I have never had this done so it would probably not be much help for me to advise.

Can I ask you to put this in your timeline? The timeline is a good place to log such an item.
Posted Apr 19 2013#3 of 11
jrsolsjeffUser Since: Apr 2013Posts: 15Sure no problem. Thanks anyway. I was just curious. I worry too much and thought maybe someone could help me get past that. Kind of a long question though....

Posted Apr 20 2013#4 of 11
PVCManUser Since: Oct 2009Posts: 228I to am a big worrier.

If I don't have anything to worry about... I try to think of something!!! :-)
Posted Apr 23 2013#5 of 11
Naveen SheikhUser Since: Apr 2013Posts: 1

QUOTE:
Bare with me..I’m new and have a lot to say LOL
In addition to PVC’s, I possibly have PSVT. My Cardiologist has referred me to conultation with an EP for ablation for the PSVT. He is not concerned at all about my PVC’s. However he has not given me a definitive daignosis of PSVT. He ordered a 30 day holter which my insurance denied. Based on my symptoms when I describe these ”episodes” and the fact I have had probably 40 normal ECG’s (between two cardiologist, multiple ER visits and two GP’s) as well as 2 normal 24 hour holters, one 7 day holter and two echo’s all normal, he feels PSVT is the cause of what I call “episodes”.

These episodes start with 4-5 very aggressive thumps in my chest (PVC’s, but stronger than the ones I get daily) from there my heart rate escilates rapidly from a normal 70-80 bpm to almost 200 bpm within a minute or less. Just as rapidly as it begins, it stops after 1-5 minutes of steady tachycardia. I usually end up taking 5-10mg of inderal. This is accompanied with shortness of breath and lightheadedness. It is not a panic attack because sometimes I will feel PVC’s and panic with anticipation that this “episode” will occur and most times, even with the panic…it doesn’t. Then when I last expect it, I’ll get these stronger PVC’s then suddenly Im in a whirlwind of tachycardia. When I have panic attacks they last from at least 10 mins to what feels like eternity and the anxiety before and after is consuming. These episodes are more frightening than panic attacks because they seem more real but recovery is much better for some reason. It concerns me because the fear of the stronger PVC’s triggering a tachycardia puts me in fear of developing ventricle fibrilation. I don’t know why, it just does. I get these episodes about once a month with no ryhme or reason to them. I thought maybe they were associated with my cycle and caused by hormones but that’s not always the case so my assumption now is they are just random.

A few facts about me, 32 yrs Female, history of anxiety and panic disorder. Digestive issue’s (slow bowels, heart burn) even on a very healthy diet of lean fish and raw fruits/veggies. I have a gluten intolerance, history of presyncope and chronic low blood pressure.

My questions are as follows
Has anybody here had ablation for a ventricle tachycardia and was it a cause for PVC’s or make PVC’s worse? I am afraid that ablating the tachycardia will cause PVC’s to worsen. I don’t want to correct one issue and make another worse.
Does anybody here have PSVT and does my situation sound like what you go through, are strong PVC’s a common precursor?
Does the benefit of ablation outweigh the risk? A question for a Dr I know but in your experience (for anyone who has experience) was it a benefit?
Has anyone had their PSVT get worse or more frequent if not treated or anyone ever experience it goes away or lessons over time?


I am terrified to have a procedure done since I don’t trust doctors and I always cure naturally. But the PSVT is so frightening at times I think Ill do anything to get rid of it. It is scarier than PVC’s, PVCs are daily so more of a bother and cause anxiety but the PSVT is a nightmare. I honestly don’t know which is worse. One is everyday but the other is more vicious.



dont worry about your PVC it is benign you can do a 24hrs holter tp see the grading of PVC and take clonazepam at night try to avoid caffeine containing foods and if you r not asthmatic start betablocker 10mg tds, i have PVC now it is controlled try to avoid anxiety
Posted Apr 23 2013#6 of 11
jrsolsjeffUser Since: Apr 2013Posts: 15

QUOTE:


dont worry about your PVC it is benign you can do a 24hrs holter tp see the grading of PVC and take clonazepam at night try to avoid caffeine containing foods and if you r not asthmatic start betablocker 10mg tds, i have PVC now it is controlled try to avoid anxiety



My PVC's don't really scare me as they use to. They are bothersome in that cause symptoms and slow me down but they do not make me think I'm going to die like they used to. The only time they really scare me is when I feel like they trigger an episode of PSVT which is what happened the last time I felt any PVC's. I already avoid caffeine and anything else that I know triggers them. I take ativan for anxiety but very rarely as I hate taking prescribed or OTC chemical medications.

On another note, I have had PVC's everyday for almost a year (since June 11, 2009) but gladly today I can say I am on day 6 of literally none....not even one. I don't know why exactly. It's very strange but I'm not complaining. The only thing I can think of is maybe its because I added more protein to my diet about two weeks ago and also added Apple Cider Vinegar (even though I test a little acidic when I do PH strips). I stopped eating red meat when I was only 15 (32 now) and eliminated poultry in 2009. A couple weeks ago I felt maybe my problem could be that I wasn't getting enough amino acids, even though I supplemented amino's, and B vitamins which I also supplemented, due to the lack of protein in my diet. I know foods are the best source for essential nutrients so I added organic free range chicken to my diet 2-3 times a week about 2 weeks ago. I always ate fish but only a couple times a week. Besides adding more meat and ACV I don't know why else I would suddenly be free from the PVC's. I'm loving it though!!!! I have even tested this by consuming some trigger foods I haven't had in a while like chocolate, orange juice, a banana and even some half cafe coffee...still not a one PVC. Something to consider for anyone who might be on a low protein diet or vegetarian or even pescetarian like me.

I am a strong advocate of a meat/dairy free raw foodie lifestyle but I happen to know for myself I wasn't getting enough plant protein in my diet to compensate the lack of animal protein. Protein deficiency may have been my problem. And anyone with PVC's knows, regardless of your belief's or lifestyle you will do anything that will stop PVC's even if it compromises those things. Ill keep everyone posted on weather or not my PVC's return.

Posted May 07 2013#7 of 11
AndyRewUser Since: Nov 2009Posts: 22

QUOTE:
I am terrified to have a procedure done since I don’t trust doctors and I always cure naturally. But the PSVT is so frightening at times I think Ill do anything to get rid of it. It is scarier than PVC’s, PVCs are daily so more of a bother and cause anxiety but the PSVT is a nightmare. I honestly don’t know which is worse. One is everyday but the other is more vicious.



jrsolsjeff...

Did you have an ablation, or did you decide not to based on your last post where you said the PVCs had subsided?

Let us know as I have always been interested as to the experiences people have with this treatment.
Posted May 07 2013#8 of 11
WinenutUser Since: May 2013Posts: 2Where do you get authoritative information saying that PVCs are benign? Are you relying on one more doctors, who haven't a clue as to what actually causes PACs and PVCs?...and so in the absence of folks dying around them, they decide it's not harmful?

BTW, as used by Medical Profession the word benign does not mean not harmful. It only means it's not life threatening. A tumor can be benign, but generally you should have it removed anyway, as it will continue to grow.

In any case, assuming a healthy heart (and you should have already had an Echo Cardiogram to determine that), PACs and PVCs are almost always the result of an Electrolyte Imbalance...generally where the tissues cells of the body are low in Potassium. This is does not generally show up on a blood test...and there many studies to prove this is true. That doctors rely on blood serum levels of Potassium exclusively (despite over 15 years of studies proving otherwise) just shows how clueless they actually are with this problem. They don't know, and they don't see patients dying...and so they take the ultra-conservative approach.

Low Potassium is THE major cause of most electrically related arrhythmias...which means most of them.

Ablation is often recommended when they can't get the heart rate down. But it's high, because the body is trying to pump blood...and the heart is beating too inefficiently due to the arrhythmias. Ablation does not solve the overall problem. It just solves the high heart rate. This is so stupid...as doctors figure they can manage the other problems with drugs. Ablation DOES NOT prevent arrhythmias where chambers are firing on their due to enhanced sensitivity to abnormally high electrical activity (caused by low Potassium)...and that causes the Atria and/or Ventricles to contract out of sequence. And this has been shown over and over by studies over the past 10-15 years.

But AMA doesn't know what else to do, as they have yet to recognize the blood serum Potassium readings are often wrong, and almost always wrong for those suffering from arrythmias. But most doctors follow AMA recommendations.

See my post on PACs/PVCs and Potassium.

Please note that there are expections, and arrythmias can results from too much Potassium (though this is much more rare). And don't just start popping Potassium pills. You need to start slowly. Also, don't rely on the worst form of Potassium (which is the garbage prescribed by doctors). It's too much at one time, and too harsh on your stomach).

Or try loading up on Potassium rich foods, such as Bananas, Halibut, or dried fruits...as it's usually best to get your Potassium naturally.

Steve





Posted May 07 2013#9 of 11
jrsolsjeffUser Since: Apr 2013Posts: 15I am not having an ablation after all. I went last Thursday to see a Cardiologist in Los Angeles who was the doctor I was referred to for the ablation. He determined that the ablation is not necessary and said ablation is for people whose issue IS an Arrhythmia. In my case, my arrhythmia (which consists of tachycardia and PVC's) are symptoms of something else. I have to go back on Wednesday the 15th for a Tilt Table Test and then stay in the hospital for a couple days for monitoring. He believes I have dysautonomia which is causing my blood vessels to not constrict properly. This is causing my chronic low blood pressure and in turn my heart is trying to pump the blood more efficiently to compensate causing the tachycardia. All of these events in turn are depleting me of magnesium. My body is using it up rapidly due to the stress of my heart over compensating as well as the anxiety caused by the symptoms.

I already know all there is to know about electrolyte imbalance. I am a big time supplementer. I have a cupboard the size of a small pantry full of everything from Vitamin C to Alpha Lipoic acid. Potassium and several forms of chelated magnesium are definitely included. I am approaching week 3 as of tomorrow of being PVC free with exception of maybe two or three over the last 3 weeks which I believe is due to hiking up my magnesium intake even prior to this recent Cardio visit. I have had low blood potassium levels many times in ER's and routine labs and it was actually due to magnesium deficiency. Potassium levels are regulated by magnesium. If calcium is high and magnesium is low, all sorts of deficiency occurs. Increasing my magnesium leveled out my calcium and potassium. I currently take 600mg a day of magnesium, 300mg of Mag Taurate and 300mg of Mag Citrate. I also take 100mg of potassium and eat 2 banana's a day as well as 1 avocado and a glass of OJ for potassium. I am also an avid raw juicer and live about a 60% raw organic diet. Additionally I also take B1, B12, B Complex, probiotics, digestive enzymes, taurine, L-arginine, D3, Vitamin E and CoQ10 and and liquid aminos.

The dysautonomia explains several other symptoms that I did not realize were all related to the heart and blood pressure symptoms. A huge relief to know one diagnosis and one treatment will take care of the whole ordeal. The Cardiologist I am seeing is my 3rd cardiologist, 4th you count one Electrophysiologist I saw last December. I have had several holter's, about 50 EKG's just in the last year between Doctor and ER visits and two echo's and two stress tests. My heart is perfectly fine according to the every doctor/cardio. My PVC's are (or were) certainly related to deficiency but the reason why had yet to be explained until now.

The doctor wants to try to put me on a couple different medications to treat the Dysautonomia, one being a beta blocker for the tachycardia and one being a Vaso-constrictor for the low Blood pressure. I am however objecting to the medications because I am not a fan of pharmaceuticals and I strongly believe in natural cures, not traditional medicine. Once the diagnosis is made final I plan to treat myself with Licorice root and himalayan pink sea salt both of which raises BP and 5 HTP which regulates serotonin levels which also regulates blood pressure. The magnesium has already helped with the tachycardia and I can continue to gradually increase the dose of magnesium if tachycardia remains an issue. Raising my blood pressure should eliminate the tachycardia since the low blood pressure is causing it in the first place.

So there's my update. I will blog again after my hospital stay which is May 15-17.

Posted May 08 2013#10 of 11
PVCManUser Since: Oct 2009Posts: 228jrsolsjeff, thanks for the update...

It's good to hear you are getting somewhere so you at least know where you stand.

I think the cardiologists saying you don't need an ablation indicates they are looking at your case properly rather than just fobbing you off which often seems to be the case these days.

Many sufferers get close to despair simply because they don't understand why they are having so much trouble, but when we start to get some information about why we have these problems, I think it helps a great deal.

I totally agree with your natural approach. I have never taken beta blockers and I hope I never have to. In fact I firmly believe it was pharmaceuticals that previously triggered all my PVC issues. Coming off them was the best choice I ever made.

I do think quite often, the medical industry (and it is an industry) are too quick to try and cure something (with drugs) rather than try to prevent it.
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